VS

[Lupin]

Fifth, with as big as claws as they have, they should climb like a cat, and plus thier stronger so they can pull thier weight more and having claws makes it easier rather than your palm hands. Go ahead, try climbing the trunk of a tree with your bare hands.

Two things:
A) Their claws aren't sharp like a cat's.
2) A cat's limbs have much greater outward mobility than a dog's/wolf's.

[Shadow Wulf]

but there half human, these are gastalts not full wolf forms, and plus from what I can tell in a bunch of artwork and movies werewolfs have sharper claws than regular humans.

[Lupin]

Movies also tell you that a werewolf can form out of a puddle of goo, and that werewolves lack tails.

[Shadow Wulf]

Movies also tell you that a werewolf can form out of a puddle of goo, and that werewolves lack tails.

tails are a bonus, nothing necesary to have for a HALF HUMAN ANIMAL just look at the van helsing werewolf. But what about the artwork plenty of people draw, they make the claws very sharp.

[Lupin]

tails are a bonus, nothing necesary to have for a HALF HUMAN ANIMAL just look at the van helsing werewolf. But what about the artwork plenty of people draw, they make the claws very sharp.

Well my point was that movies aren't exactly the best place to get authorative information on werewolves, since they do all sorts of crazy [spoiler]s***[/spoiler] with them. Remeber this is a forum for changing the typical Hollywood werewolf.

[outwarddoodles]

first, why are you reffering everything to freeborn werewolves when no one has ever said that, Im pretty shure we are reffuring to werewolfs overall.

Screw it then! I imagine a the werewolf one inch tall. Walla humans win!

Theres no point in this conversationa at all if we can't tall about the same things. You can imagine werewolves 50 ft tall I can imagine then an inch tall, we'll get no where because we won't be talking about the same thing. I was sugestting because we can't talk about the same thing here it would be best if we referred to freeborn werewolves or werewolves of a more realistic kind.

Speaking of a realistic kind of werewolf I'd think a human would surely win. Because a real werewolf would not have a gestalt form, just be a big wolf, human would surely win that, just look at the wolf population!

The human haves to be lightly armed to sneak more quietly and move quicker. haveing a flak jacket weighs about 15 pounds, the extra ammo, the machine guns the grenades, its all adds weight and will make alot of sound for the werewolf.

Uh, yeah, a heavy jacket, machine gun, granade and alot of ammo. Do you understand how much the werewolf would be torn to peices? When I was imagining the fight all I thought of was a guy with a rifle.

Fourth, the whole one on one thing you were saying. If you think a werewolf can use a decoy of some kindto trick the hunter, and plus in the movie everything was so quite, why didnt the hunter hear the raptor sneaking up on him. I know its just a movie but its very accurate on how they did everything if you ask me.

And humans can use decoys to trick the wolf!

Fifth, with as big as claws as they have, they should climb like a cat, and plus thier stronger so they can pull thier weight more and having claws makes it easier rather than your palm hands. Go ahead, try climbing the trunk of a tree with your bare hands.

I've seen dogs run up trees but really, never seen a wolf do that. Because the werewolf's sapposed gestalt form has human like hands and arms, they'd climb just like a human.

Sixth, coampering the rate of of average success of killing wolves compare to humans, This is irrational, we are talking a half human crature that has the mind of a man. for the werewolf Its alot easier sneaking up on a person and killing them than confronting them straight up.

So? Theres a same princible there as they way they attack. A werwolf is upfrount and hand to hand, while a human has useage of weapons.

As I said, best we just screw it. We're getting no where.

[Lupin]

I've seen dogs run up trees but really, never seen a wolf do that. Because the werewolf's sapposed gestalt form has human like hands and arms, they'd climb just like a human.

That reminded me of this picture:

http://kiza.kcore.de/wolfpaper-archive/2000-11-27


and this one:

http://kiza.kcore.de/wolfpaper-archive/2000-11-29

[Shadow Wulf]

Im not constinueing the arguement thats above or anything, but how can a wolf form be more realistic than a gastalt when a full wolf has no human qualities, it wouldnt be called a werewolf IMO.

[Lupin]

Well, werewolf only means "man wolf" so a wolf with the mind of a human would still count.

[Shadow Wulf]

I still think the gastalt is more realistic cause a werewolf is suppose to have some physical human qualities.

NOTE: Dont respond to this, im just speaking outloud of what I think.

[Lupin]

Well, werewolf only means "man wolf" so a wolf with the mind of a human would still count.

In most of the folklore I've read, werewolves looked like ordinary wolves, untill they screwed up and revealed themselves as human.

[Shadow Wulf]

really? In all the old greek and transylvanian drawings they have gastalts.

[WolvenOne]

Vuldari, it's a classic werewolf strength that I just threw in as an example. Whether or not it's logical or not is.... kinda a whole other matter. ;)

[outwarddoodles]

I still think the gastalt is more realistic cause a werewolf is suppose to have some physical human qualities.

NOTE: Dont respond to this, im just speaking outloud of what I think.

Ermm...what about my ideas? Can't I speak out loud of what I think?

but how can a wolf form be more realistic than a gastalt when a full wolf has no human qualities, it wouldnt be called a werewolf IMO.

I've explained this different times around these forums. A gestalt does not exsist as a wolf or human does. Theres DNA for a human form, and theres DNA for a wolf form. There is no DNA absolutly in this world that contains information for a gestalt form. None, zip. In Freeborn's werewolves we add that, yet theres none in the real world. If werewolves were real it would be a human added the information for a wolf form, there would only be that time (which I predict would be a very long time.) inbetween the shift that would be more hybrid, yet it wouldn't mean the DNA is that way, just their body is still int hat position (such as say my hair color gene changed to red, my hair wouldn't instantly change red, there would still be my brown hair, just the new hair would grow red.)

And, werewolves don't have to constantly be able to shift. Someone who had shifted pernamently into a wolf is a werewolf, just once human and now wolf.

[Renorei]

Sharpness of Wolf Claws

I'd think it'd be possible for the gestalt forms of werewolves to have extremely sharp claws, since they have just grown. A dog's claws aren't sharp, because they've worn them down from walking, but a really young puppy has very sharp claws, because they haven't worn them down yet. So, I think it's possible that a werewolf could have really sharp claws, because they just grew out and haven't been worn down yet.

Wolf Vision

By human standards, we have better vision than they do, because we can see color, which is important for humans. But canines can detect movement with their vision much better than we can, even though their colors are kinda washed out. I think in the scenario to which Anubis is referring, the vision of the werewolf would actually be more advantageous, so the argument that we have better vision is a little bit questionable here.

Climbing Trees

I'd think a werewolf would be able to climb trees better than a human, but not nearly as well as a cat.
Reasons:
1. Sharper Claws (see top paragraph)
2. They are stronger (this is my personal opinion, however the majority of werewolf fans, not including this forum, seem to share it)

The only hitch with the climbing would be that they might weigh more. However, I think their added strength would be able to compensate for the added weight, and then some. I'm not going to argue whether this would actually be true or not, I'm just basing this on most people's werewolf preferences (once again, not necessarily the people in this forum.)


Anyway, doodle is right, there's not much point in arguing about this, since we all have different perceptions of what a werewolf actually is. But, I just wanted to offer my opinions about some of the issues discussed. I am not stating that I think the werewolf would win, it really depends a lot on the situation at hand and what a werewolf actually is.

[Set]

The only hitch with the climbing would be that they might weigh more. However, I think their added strength would be able to compensate for the added weight, and then some.

Well the real problem with that is not the strength of the werewolf, but the strength of the tree. It does no good to be able to chuck a car across a football field if you climb a tree too weak to support your weight.

[Renorei]

The only hitch with the climbing would be that they might weigh more. However, I think their added strength would be able to compensate for the added weight, and then some.

Well the real problem with that is not the strength of the werewolf, but the strength of the tree. It does no good to be able to chuck a car across a football field if you climb a tree too weak to support your weight.

LOL, yeah that'd be a problem too. I was thinking more of the big oak trees and old pines near my house.

[Set]

Pines are soft wood, therefore are weaker than other trees in general. Especially old ones. The oak trees would be fine, but if even some skinny little shrimp tried climbing the pines the branches would snap really quickly.

[Renorei]

Pines are soft wood, therefore are weaker than other trees in general. Especially old ones. The oak trees would be fine, but if even some skinny little shrimp tried climbing the pines the branches would snap really quickly.

Huh. *Suddenly feels very paranoid about family's deerstands located in pine trees*

I've never actually climbed a pine tree, but it was my assumption that they were fairly strong. I suppose the trunk would be ok for climbing, but the thing you said about the branches makes sense.

[Set]

The trunk alone would be ok if it's a big tree. They're not near as strong as hardwoods though. As long as weight isn't put on the branches it should be fine.

[Renorei]

I noticed your dogs in your signature. They are very cute . Are they male and female, if so, do you plan on breeding them?

[Set]

The black and tan is male and the cream one is female. (She doesn't really qualify as "white" anymore.) They've had several litters before, and I'm pretty sure she's pregnant again.

[Renorei]

The black and tan is male and the cream one is female. (She doesn't really qualify as "white" anymore.) They've had several litters before, and I'm pretty sure she's pregnant again.

YAY!! I never get tired of puppies. I can't tell you how many hundreds, maybe thousands, of puppies I've seen in my lifetime, but it never gets old.

[Vilkacis]

YAY!! I never get tired of puppies. I can't tell you how many hundreds, maybe thousands, of puppies I've seen in my lifetime, but it never gets old.

-- Vilkacis

[Renorei]

YAY!! I never get tired of puppies. I can't tell you how many hundreds, maybe thousands, of puppies I've seen in my lifetime, but it never gets old.

-- Vilkacis

LOL, I've seen that one before, but it still comes as a shock.